Maps, Directions, and Place Reviews
Proposed Changes
goodness, this page is terrible-"the fresh root is so expensive?" this is not a message board, and much of this research is frought with epidemiological fallacies "people who ate yellow curry once in six months.." such a dose is useless, but also doesnt point out the far more likely factors (how about eating fish? pancakes? asprin? ect) broad misrepresentation-curcumin has terrible bioavailablity, but this page makes it seem like the perfect drug for anything and what little logic there is in the entry is muddled by pointless edits FIX OR DELETE!
Maybe we could start by dividing the Medicinal Uses section into categories, such as antioxidant, anti-inflammatory, cancer, neurodegenerative diseases, and so forth. We could start adding data to the different headings and the information would be more organized. I have done some research on curcumin, and I have a list of 19 physiological properties (with citations) that could be added as a table, and some other material that could be added to the content. I agree with the comment below - low bioavailability doesn't mean no bioavailability, and many physiological/therapeutic effects have been documented. I am a new editor as well.--Little Flower Eagle (talk) 20:42, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
This article needs a better structure. New to editing wikipedia, and not entirely sure of the protocol but I would recommend: 1. Creating a separate section regarding the bioavailability of curcumin. The review article is a good place to start looking. The article is not entirely misrepresentative of the therapeutic potential of curcumin. Despite having low bioavailability, curcumin has been documented to have therapeutic efficency against several diseases including cancer, diabetes, and arthritis. 2. Creating a proposed mechanisms of action section. 3. Removing "x group in year xxxx did ..." from sections. Those type of statements I believe sound more like press releases and less like an encyclopedia If there is consensus this is a good idea, I will make these changes.--Biophysik (talk) 06:47, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
--Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.219.235.232 (talk) 21:58, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
also the supposed selectivity for mao-a isnt cited, the maoi article says that its non selective (and that isnt cited either). whats the deal? does anybody know? --Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.164.172.232 (talk) 02:16, 25 March 2010 (UTC)
Curcumin With Black Pepper Video
Misrepresentation of research (title added)
The research article mentioned in the Wikipedia definition of curcumin and its prooxidant effects on DNA (Kelly MR, Xu J, Alexander KE, Loo G. 2001. Disparate effects of similar phenolic phytochemicals as inhibitors of oxidative damage to cellular DNA. Mutat Res. May 10;485(4):309-18.) have not been accurately described.
The article clearly states "Therefore, it is concluded that NDGA has antioxidant activity but curcumin has prooxidant activity in cultured cells based on their opposite effects on DNA". The key terms in this sentence are "in cultured cells". Therefore, in the Wikipedia description of curcumin where this article is addressed, it should not state that this research "proves" curcumin's prooxidant affects. The data presented in the referenced article provides in vitro evidence of a prooxidant affect on cultured cells. It is clearly a stretch to say it proves this activity occurs in vivo, e.g. when humans consume curcumin. The paragraph describing this research is extremely misleading, especially to non-scientists, and should be removed from the web-description of curcumin. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ajourdan (talk o contribs) .
It is fundamentally wrong to cite the Kelly article as showing anything about the effects of curcumin on healthy cells. In this study, the authors used Jurkat T-cells. Jurkat cells are cancer cells. Any effect of curcumin on these cells cannot be reliably extrapolated to healthy cells. As the work of Michael Karin has shown, cancer cells have high levels of NF-kappa B activity and depend on this for survival. Bharat Aggarwal, at M. D. Anderson Cancer Center, has shown that curcumin inhibits NF-kappa B activity. This effect will cause apoptosis (programmed cell death) in cancer cells.
The benefit of the doubt is not more deserving for one side of the battle or the other. The fact that nothing scientific is never "proven" does not grant the other side the right to declare it "disproven" or invalid. Only those assertions which can be disproven should be removed from a Wikipedia article.Landroo (talk) 13:24, 16 September 2016 (UTC)
Contradictory statements need to be resolved
In Paragraph 5, the second sentence reads:
"Its anticancer effects stem from its ability to induce apoptosis in cancer cells without cytotoxic effects on healthy cells."
But in Paragraphs 9 and 10, the text states:
"However, as pointed out by Kawanishi et al. (2005) curcumin is a "double-edged sword" having both anti-cancer and carcinogenic effects.
"Curcumin has devastating effects on healthy human cells."
It seems to me that having "devastating effects on healthy human cells" would reasonably constitute a "cytotoxic effect[] on healthy cells," would it not? Either way, perhaps some clarification by someone knowledgeable might be in order?
Until the biovailability issue is addressed adequately, discussion of potential medical uses is ridiculous (except for benefits that might occur within the digestive tract.)```` --Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.127.229.103 (talk) 20:49, 28 October 2009 (UTC)
Psychotropic effects?
A friend of mine consistently gets in a better mood when eating some yellow-coloured foods and sweets, but not with others, and I found the common factor was curcumin being used as the colorant in those that had this effect. Is anyone aware of any such psychotropic effects, theoretical or otherwise? It would seem the low bioavailability should prevent any significant absorption. Zuiram 23:57, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
Unless he's eating a buncha Piperine with it. :0)192.249.47.11 18:04, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
I guess I'm confused - how is it that curcumin is shown to helping these diseases if it isn't bioavailable? Something has to be absorbing, right? Otherwise the improvements would be attributed to a placebo effect. Can someone please clarify for me? How much curcumin is in 1 teaspoon of turmeric anyway? --Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.36.219.59 (talk) 17:16, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
Maybe your friend is subconsciously associating yellow with smiley faces and sunshine! --Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.223.156.139 (talk) 14:13, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Misc
Dr. Dennis Liotta is a chemistry professor at Emory University in Atlanta.
Along with Dr. Raymond F. Schinazi and Dr. Woo-Baeg Choi of Emory, he discovered Emtricitabine, which is a breakthrough HIV drug; it was sold to Gilead Sciences in July 2005 for $525 million and it is marketed under the name Emtriva. --The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.19.17.2 (talk o contribs) .
Does dried, ground tumeric oxidize? The fresh root is so expensive. --63.24.85.190 06:14, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
Does anyone know what the excitation and emission fluorescence spectra of curcumin is? 129.43.47.159 18:25, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Curcumin is essentially non-fluorescent (and unstable) in water. A weak broad emission can be detected at 550 nm using 420 excitation. In a non-polar environment such as a lipid membrane or after curcumin binds to serum albumin, the fluorescence is increased and blue-shifted with a 498 nm emission maximum using 420nm excitation.--Biophysik (talk) 06:47, 6 October 2008 (UTC)
Curcumin in isopropyl alcohol can also be used as a pH indicator...should this be included? It's an interesting fact, but I'm not sure how it would fit anywhere.
WikiProject Food and drink Tagging
This article talk page was automatically added with {{WikiProject Food and drink}} banner as it falls under Category:Food or one of its subcategories. If you find this addition an error, Kindly undo the changes and update the inappropriate categories if needed. The bot was instructed to tagg these articles upon consenus from WikiProject Food and drink. You can find the related request for tagging here . Maximum and careful attention was done to avoid any wrongly tagging any categories , but mistakes may happen... If you have concerns , please inform on the project talk page -- TinucherianBot (talk) 01:19, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
Turmeric should be tagged, circumin should not be
Shjacks45 (talk) 06:34, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
Bioavailability and black pepper
Apparently, curcumin is not bioavailable. Yet, there are reports that brains of people who eat turmeric all their lives are stained yellow or orange. Observed on autopsy... (I confess, I don't know if these reports are reliable.)
Piperine seems to increase the bioavailability of curcumin.
When turmeric is used in cooking, in India and Pakistan, it is used in various combination with other spices. The combination of spices is called curry, as we know. As far as I know, black pepper is another common ingredient in curry. Black pepper is rich in piperine.
So, you've gotta wonder if the combination of black curry with turmeric in South Asia, represents some kind of indigenous folk medicine that increases the bioavailability of turmeric, by the addition of black pepper.
I don't know if there's been any research on this. I wouldn't know where to begin.
68.127.235.15 (talk) 04:44, 1 October 2009 (UTC)
Wording re piperine absorbtion study
The following wordig currently appears in the article (italics, mine):
"Co-supplementation with 20 mg of piperine (extracted from black pepper) significantly increased the absorption of curcumin by 2000% in a study funded by a prominent manufacturer of piperine.[30] However, the increase in absorption only occurred during the first hour, in which the difference between the piperine curcumin and the regular curcumin was almost the same as far as absorption."
Would whoever is familiar with / has read this study please take a look at the wording? The "in which" would seem to contradict the main point being made. I strongly suspect that what is really meant is "after which".--Ericjs (talk) 22:32, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
Infobox inconsistencies
The infobox shows an image of the enol form, yet the SMILES formula is of the ketone form. Is that OK? The correct SMILES for the given image is O=C(\C=C\c1ccc(O)c(OC)c1)CC(O)\C=C\c2cc(OC)c(O)cc2 --94.73.47.98 (talk) 09:49, 17 February 2011 (UTC)
Primary Sources in Medical Section
I see some big problems in the medical section of this article; namely, an over reliance on primary sources of dubious significance (test tube and animal studies, small scale uncontrolled clinical trials) and lack of consensus statements and reviews. The article vastly overstates the medical relevance of curcumin; it has elements of WP:OR and WP:SYNTH and would benefit from a much more balanced POV. See also WP:MEDRS and WP:PRIMARY. Rhode Island Red (talk) 00:34, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
At least the date of a study helps to weed out dated sources and to focus on MEDRS sources, which are RECENT SECONDARY sources. Regarding reliance on primary sources, practically all articles dealing with herbal, alternative, traditional, naturopathic or ethnic medicine have that, even more if ever the word "cancer" or "HIV" was mentioned in the past 100 years. Even worse, these primary sources get mixed with "healthy living" pamphlets and advertisements for (sarcasm)"Olde-Buzzard vitaminized raven lard, according to ancient indigenous recipes, improves rheumatism and your golf scores"(/sarcasm) 70.137.144.94 (talk) 05:53, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
Agree. I believe the focus on recent secondary sources makes more sense in fields with intense activity, where a systematic progress is achieved over time, and with common medications, where the developing statistical evidence may lead to changes of prescription guidance etc. by medical and government organizations over time. In these cases old reviews may really be outdated by the accumulated experience over time, as much may have changed in say 10 years. In other cases 50 year old articles may still be as good as new.(and sometimes fun to read, I love historical sources) In all these alternative / ethnic / naturopathic / traditional medicine articles the historical part may be interesting and should be included for the historical value, but set apart from "medical" information, clearly marked as "historical". This is even true for the lotion of vitaminized "Olde Buzzard" raven lard.(which improves the golf scores) Or for the interesting "galvanic" apparatus and radioactive quack medicines which were in fashion 100 years ago, until the patients teeth fell out. There is interesting material about this and old X-ray machines at the ORAU website. All looking like from Dr. Frankensteins laboratory, with humpback assistant "Igor" adjusting the voltage on the "Rumkorff Inductor". 70.137.130.84 (talk) 21:02, 18 March 2012 (UTC) 70.137.130.84 (talk) 21:02, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
So I imagine that we have Medical Sections, from (preferably recent) review articles, reflecting contemporary state of encyclopedic and widely agreed information. Then "Research Section" with interesting primary research cited as "A (year) study on (species) (material) found (short findings)". e.g. "A 1990 study on rat tumor cell line XYZ found that X suppressed Y at a concentration of Z nmol/ml" (Single case reports are useless here, as almost everything has once been observed on some patient)
This may not be carried too far, as otherwise immediately zealots come in who cherry-pick primaries to prove that Aspirin immediately causes cancer and impotence, which can be prevented by co-administration of curcuma with raven-lard according to olde voodo recipe. Also to prove that it is a cure-all panacea even against cancer and HIV etc. etc. etc.
Then if applicable Section "History" may contain references like the 1850 Pharmacists Handbook etc. if the history looks interesting. "has already been recommended in 1850 for the tumbness of horses in a dosis of 30 drachms in strong brandy..." etc. (I make these up of course) 70.137.155.252 (talk) 06:08, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
Preliminary research for potential health effects
I made this addition of a comprehensive secondary source - a journal review - only for User:Zefr to remove it on grounds of WP:MEDRS, however re: WP:MEDRS: the journal "Molecules" is indeed listed in MEDLINE see here: http://locatorplus.gov/cgi-bin/Pwebrecon.cgi?DB=local&v1=1&ti=1,1&Search_Arg=100964009&Search_Code=0359&CNT=1&SID=1 , and has been established for nearly 20 years https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molecules_%28journal%29 (impact factor 2.095 is not amazing, but not disastrous either). Unlike the examples given in WP:MEDS this is not a case of e.g. a review on oncogenesis appearing in a psychology journal. "Molecules" includes "natural product chemistry" in its remit, and the review concerns itself with the biochemistry of curcumin - I would argue there is sufficient overlap of fields to justify inclusion.
Opinions of other editors please, as to the quality of this review / author reputation / quality & relevance of journal, and whether or not the following should be included on the Curcumin page:
Sethi et al published an in depth 2015 review of the scientific literature re: curcumin's interaction with molecules implicated in oncogenesis, in the peer-reviewed open access journal Molecules, in which they concluded: "A plethora of in vitro and in vivo research together with clinical trials conducted over the past few decades substantiate the potential of curcumin as an anti-cancer agent. At the molecular level, curcumin targets numerous pathways, highlighting its ability to inhibit carcinogenesis at multiple levels and thus, potentially circumventing the development of resistance. However, there is a paucity of data to explain the underlying mechanism of its activity. Clinical trials with curcumin indicate safety, tolerability, non-toxicity (even up to doses of 8000 mg/day), and efficacy. These studies provide a solid foundation for more well-controlled studies in larger cohorts as well as open avenues for future drug development. However, curcumin activity is limited by its poor bioavailability and some possible adverse effects. The development of formulations of curcumin in the form of nanoparticles, liposomes, micelles or phospholipid complexes to enhance its bioavailability and efficacy are still in its early stages. Nonetheless, curcumin has established itself as a safe and promising molecule for the prevention and therapy of not only cancer but also other inflammation-driven diseases." ~~User:Dukeredwulf~~ (unsigned comment by Dukeredwulf 02:57, 13 April 2015?)
Unclear Statement
From the article: "More recently, curcumin was found to alter iron metabolism by chelating iron and suppressing the protein hepcidin, potentially causing iron deficiency in susceptible patients."
Wait. Chelating iron might cause iron deficiency but suppressing hepcidin will increase iron transport by enterocytes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hepcidin#Tissues -- Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.158.8.37 (talk) 03:53, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
Note for consideration by topic experts: recent retractions of research articles on curcumin
In February 2016, the publisher of Biochemical Pharmacology issued retraction notices for seven (7) articles originally published in that journal during the period 2007-2011, at least five of which involve research on curcumin; links to sites providing further details are below. Fortunately none of the retracted research articles are cited in this Wikipedia article. But given the nature of the retractions, I felt I should bring it to the attention of any experts on curcumin who check in here, even though the retractions do not appear to affect this Wikipedia article in any direct way. (Although I am a research chemist, I am not a biochemist, and certainly not an expert on curcumin.) For further information on the retractions, see the bottom seven items of this Table-of-Contents listing. Further discussion of these retractions was also posted in the blog Retraction Watch; the link is here. Because none of the retracted articles were cited in this article, and because of my limited knowledge of this topic, I did not edit the article content (I only made a couple minor edits to External Links). I am providing this information under Talk, so that anyone with appropriate expertise will be made aware of this situation, and can assess the information and determine whether changes to this Wikipedia article are in fact warranted based on those retractions.Sharl928 (talk) 08:21, 24 February 2016 (UTC)
Business
I've added some basic business-related information. It might be interesting to expand this to say that it's mostly produced in India, and mostly sold in Canada and the U.S.
I've seen predictions for sales approximately quintupling during the next decade, but I thought that was probably too speculative to be included. As far as I can tell, that market-growth estimate all goes back to a single consulting firm. It's been repeated everywhere, but it seems to be just one source behind that number. WhatamIdoing (talk) 20:06, 29 February 2016 (UTC)
Recent lit to incorporate
A few meta-analyses and systemic reviews worth incorporating into the Article. Al-Karawi/Phytother Res reported improvement for depression. Sahebkar/Pain Med concluded benefit for pain relief. Sahebkar/Clin Nutr concluded that curcumin did not affect circulating lipids. Sahebkar/Phytother concluded that curcumin lowered CRP (C-reactive protein, a questionable biomarker for risk of cardiovascular disease), but the results hinged on which product and duration of study. Brondino/ScientificWorld reported no benefit for dementia, based on inclusion of three human trials. Zhang is an all-purpose review.
Al-Karawi D, Al Mamoori DA, Tayyar Y. The Role of Curcumin Administration in Patients with Major Depressive Disorder: Mini Meta-Analysis of Clinical Trials. Phytother Res. 2016 Feb;30(2):175-83.
Sahebkar A, Henrotin Y. Analgesic Efficacy and Safety of Curcuminoids in Clinical Practice: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis of Randomized Controlled Trials. Pain Med.(in press).
Sahebkar A. A systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials investigating the effects of curcumin on blood lipid levels. Clin Nutr. 2014 Jun;33(3):406-14.
Sahebkar A. Are curcuminoids effective C-reactive protein-lowering agents in clinical practice? Evidence from a meta-analysis. Phytother Res. 2014 May;28(5):633-42.
Brondino N, Re S, Boldrini A, Cuccomarino A, Lanati N, Barale F, Politi P. Curcumin as a therapeutic agent in dementia: a mini systematic review of human studies. ScientificWorldJournal. 2014 Jan 22;2014:174282. Zhang DW, et al. Curcumin and diabetes: a systematic review. Evid Based Complement Alternat Med. 2013;2013:636053.
Revert
I cited material from Wilken, Reason; Veena, Mysore S.; Wang, Marilene B.; Srivatsan, Eri S. (2011-01-01). "Curcumin: A review of anti-cancer properties and therapeutic activity in head and neck squamous cell carcinoma". Molecular Cancer. 10: 12. doi:10.1186/1476-4598-10-12. ISSN 1476-4598. PMC 3055228 . PMID 21299897. , which was immediately reverted without discussion. I claim that this is a reliable, secondary source. I make no other claim about its contents. Thus, I don't see the basis for the revert. Lfstevens (talk) 02:26, 16 June 2016 (UTC)
Moved from my Talk:
There is no accepted clinical evidence of curcumin having any role as a therapeutic. Evidence would require sources that satisfy WP:MEDRS. Please understand this guideline before editing an article for medicinal effects. You have a Cure Award, so should be standing behind MEDRS sourcing. Thanks. --Zefr (talk) 22:55, 15 June 2016 (UTC)
Effect in ulcerative colitis?
Although the statement and source below are from a Cochrane collaboration analysis, I think this result is too weak to deserve even mentioning it. The source is weak MEDRS at best. --Zefr (talk) 17:59, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
Reverted statement and source... for discussion
A Cochrane review found that curcumin may be an effective adjunct for ulcerative colitis, when given with standard therapy, however more trials are needed to confirm this.
Main finding, quoted: "Only one trial (89 patients) fulfilled the inclusion criteria. This trial randomized 45 patients to curcumin and 44 patients to placebo. All patients received treatment with sulfasalazine or mesalamine. The study was rated as low risk of bias. Curcumin was administered orally in a dose of 2 g/day for six months. Fewer patients relapsed in the curcumin group than the placebo group at six months. Four per cent of patients in the curcumin group relapsed at six months compared to 18% of patients in the placebo group (RR 0.24, 95% CI 0.05 to 1.09; P = 0.06)."
That's actually pretty funny.Petergstrom (talk) 18:58, 13 January 2017 (UTC)
Curcumin found to be an MAOI (e.g. in mouse brain studies)
Curcumin is widely acknowledged to be an MAOI, and multiple studies, e.g. of mouse brains, have supported this. I added the following to the article's Pharmacodynamics section:
but it was reverted by Alexbrn with "Minor journal, not MEDLINE indexed; need good WP:MEDRS".
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=curcumin+monoamine returns 30 results. Do any of these satisfy the criteria for inclusion? Thank you. --Dan Harkless (talk) 06:29, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
"Pharmacodynamics"
Fancy greek for "what targets and pathways does this compound affect"? Initial studies that try to identify biological targets of compounds and work out pathways or structures that are perturbed that might cause some phenotype change, are indeed in vitro assays that are used in drug discovery and drug development. I changed the section header. Jytdog (talk) 18:49, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
Ok I'll ask
User: Rhode Island Red - in this dif you appeared to say that this edit by me was SYN. Maybe you meant that bit of content itself, but please explain. Thanks. Jytdog (talk) 23:28, 29 March 2017 (UTC)
Alternative Medicine
I see a double standard to include a single death report and link IV curcumin as the causative agent. What is WP:MEDRS on this? Is it reasonable to include notable occurrences from news sources? If so we should be careful with causality. It may have been but it could have been a contaminated med or any other number of things. In any case if we can note death from curcumin, we might link to life's purportedly saved by curcumin as per such an article- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-4726136/How-curry-spice-helped-dying-woman-beat-cancer.html Chickpecking (talk) 00:04, 8 December 2017 (UTC)
Two patients administered infusions of curcumin (a component of the spice turmeric) compounded with polyethylene glycol (PEG) 40 castor oil reportedly experienced immediate hypersensitivity reactions. The PEG 40 castor oil was a component of a curcumin emulsion product compounded by a pharmacy, ImprimisRx, located in Irvine, California. Hypersensitivity reactions to intravenous (IV) products containing polyethylene glycol castor oil have been reported in the literature and are the subject of warnings for a number of FDA-approved drugs. https://www.fda.gov/Drugs/GuidanceComplianceRegulatoryInformation/PharmacyCompounding/ucm570192.htm so instead of a reaction to curcumin, they think it was a reaction to something else in the infusion.Chickpecking (talk) 07:46, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
The cause and effect relationship between the curcumin infusion and the hypersensitivity reactions seems pretty unquestionable since it happened instantly during the infusion. There are two things about the FDA report that I found particularly remarkable: (1) the curcumin solution injected contained only 1-2% of the curcumin amount listed on the labeling; (2) the curcumin solution contained industrial grade PEG 40 castor oil. IMO, it probably was the PEG 40 CO (or its DEG byproduct) that was causitive.
But it doesn't matter for our purposes which ingredient in the solution was causative. The curcumin infusion was used as a an unapproved therapy for eczema by this naturopath and it caused serious AEs (including one death). It highlights risks of naturopaths administering IV curcumin treatments, as well as the shoddiness of the compounding pharmacy that produced the IV formulation used in these cases. All in all, the event is really quite remarkable and clearly merits inclusion in the article. As a source in this case, the FDAs thorough report is rock solid. There are no similarly solid reports alleging any cures with curcumin, and surely none where the cause and effect relationship is as obvious as it was in the case of the hypersensitivity reactions.
It's not valid to argue that including the FDA report means that we have to drastically lower the bar and include some anecdotal case report where curcumin wasn't even implicated as the therapeutic agent (the authors of the case study mentioned above implicated ECGC, not curcumin). So let's not play the game of false equivalency. Rhode Island Red (talk) 15:43, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
Too promotional?
Hello, I plan to add more to this article, however the material was labeled as "too promotional". I have changed the text in order to better follow the guidelines. Please look at my sandbox, as that is what I plan to add later. If I still need to change things, please let me know. Msri20 (talk) 06:22, 9 December 2017 (UTC)Msri20
Half-life
AFAIK, the half-life of curcumin in blood is extremely short, so kind of it's gone before reaching its target. Tgeorgescu (talk) 19:00, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
Source of the article : Wikipedia
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